Greg Todd [00:00:00]:
So I would like to ask you what, like, why do you feel like that has been so important? Why create that? What was your reasoning behind it?
Gwen Claussen [00:00:10]:
For a few different reasons. Like, one of them is it is lonely and you do start to feel bad about yourself and wonder if you're doing the right things or everything that you can. So creating a community of parents with similar struggles so that they can have each other to lean on. And it's also so we can provide more support to more people. So the community will have like an online library with resources, but also some like weekly meetings that people can come into and get support from our therapists and also from other parents. This is Secrets for Success.
Greg Todd [00:00:53]:
Welcome to the Secrets for Success podcast. I'm your host, Greg Todd. Thank you as always for joining me today. I am doing a series that I'm calling Rapid Fire Value. It is my audience, people that I work with, and they bring so much value to the marketplace, to their areas. And so I have Gwen Clawson. Gwen is one of my amazing, amazing clients, mentees friend that has a amazing business in Michigan called Flourishing Lives. And can you tell the people who you guys help? And then I'm just going to, I'm just going to ball a bunch of questions at you.
Greg Todd [00:01:33]:
Is that cool? Sure. Okay, so who do you guys help?
Gwen Claussen [00:01:36]:
We help kids and families that are struggling with sensory processing difficulties. So we help them understand their child better and connect better so that life can become easier and things are better for everyone.
Greg Todd [00:01:51]:
And you help you. You guys work with a lot of people. Like, how many clients do you guys typically work with a week?
Gwen Claussen [00:01:57]:
We're around like 320ish visits a week. And usually it's like we see everyone twice a week.
Greg Todd [00:02:05]:
Twice a week. So you've probably seen like 150 to 180 people. It's pretty wild. So here's the first question. This is not one of my rapid fire questions, but I, I'm just, I. I feel like there's been a huge change. Maybe I don't understand it because I wasn't a parent, but don't you feel like here let you live? I feel like kids are struggling more with sensory issues over the last 10 to 15 years. I don't know if it's the food, it's this that, but have you noticed that there's just been a massive influx in children that are struggling with these things?
Gwen Claussen [00:02:37]:
I do think it's more prevalent now and I think there's a lot of reasons for that. Do tell, do tell. Like what you Said, like, food. Every, like, the world is changing. The things change. And I think parenting has changed a lot. We're easier on kids now, and so, like, they're allowed to be more of themselves, and those things can, like, show more than they probably could have in the past. Oh, okay.
Gwen Claussen [00:03:03]:
There's also been a significant difference for all kids since, like, the COVID lockdowns and, like, all the screen time and everything like that. So, like, the socialization aspect was harder.
Greg Todd [00:03:16]:
Gotcha. Of those things, is there one in particular? Like, do you believe screen time has been the. Is that the biggest reason or. No.
Gwen Claussen [00:03:26]:
All right.
Greg Todd [00:03:27]:
I mean, I don't know.
Gwen Claussen [00:03:28]:
Yeah. I don't have a stance on anything in particular. Okay.
Greg Todd [00:03:34]:
Yeah. I mean, I don't know. I'm just noticing. And I don't know if it's because I work with you guys or what, but I'm just like, wow. I, I, yeah, they could use help. They could be some help. And even in my family, I'm like, okay, yeah, I, I'm seeing things now as I'm learning more and more from, from, from you guys. Okay, so let's talk about some of the things that I'm assuming your audience would have questions on.
Greg Todd [00:04:01]:
Is that cool if I just spitball them at you? Okay. Meltdowns. There's like, I, when I, when I was growing up, you, you Here was a cause of meltdowns. You're rude and, and you, and you don't know how to act. Okay. And spank the child. Okay, can you explain what are some of the causes of sensory meltdowns?
Gwen Claussen [00:04:25]:
So there's a lot of causes, but in general, it's that, like, there's just too much input to the body that's not getting processed properly, and then you just can't handle it anymore. Right. So we like to use, like, the analogy of, like, when you have a migraine and, like, or a really bad headache, it changes the way you perceive things. Like, sounds are louder.
Greg Todd [00:04:49]:
Yeah.
Gwen Claussen [00:04:50]:
Light is a lot brighter. Things are harder. Like, you can't figure out things as easily.
Greg Todd [00:04:55]:
That's what they're feeling.
Gwen Claussen [00:04:56]:
So, yeah, like, the stuff within their body is acting differently, and so they can't. Their brain's not processing correctly, all of the inputs, and then it comes out usually in kids of crying Defiance, all those types of things.
Greg Todd [00:05:11]:
Okay, so they're just not bad.
Gwen Claussen [00:05:13]:
Yes.
Greg Todd [00:05:13]:
There's a lot of things going on. Okay, I, I know. I've heard you talk about creating a calming environment. So what are some ways that parents that are listening to this can create a calming environment in the home. And, and even if they're, they're not in the home, they know that their kid is in school. Like what are strategies? Are there things that they can do?
Gwen Claussen [00:05:37]:
So like a calming environment for all the time or at times of like meltdown?
Greg Todd [00:05:42]:
Yeah, at times of like meltdown, yeah.
Gwen Claussen [00:05:44]:
So we like to use what we call the womb space. So in times of dysregulation you try to go into a small area which at home could be a bedroom, even like a walk in closet, something like that where you can build like a blanket for or something like that to get into a smaller space so it's not so overwhelming turning the lights off, having soft stuffed animals or things to play with, like calm music, things like that.
Greg Todd [00:06:13]:
Okay, that's, that's good to know. So give me some ideas of how I can know that. Whether it's my son or other people that they're having, they're, they're in a very sensory overwhelming environment. Are there certain things I could be looking for as a parent? Like oh, that's what they're dealing with right now.
Gwen Claussen [00:06:40]:
So me personally in general, I like to think that behavior is communication in all aspects. So whenever, even I use this with my like staff too. When people are acting in a way that you don't think is normal or they shouldn't be acting, I like to look for what could be causing that first rather than just assuming that they don't want to do what they're supposed to do. So a lot of times it's even like the regular things that you want your kids to do on the day to day can be really hard for them and overwhelming. Like, and we've talked about this before, like the putting your shoes on to go out the door to go to school, right? That seems that easy. That seems so easy, right? For us. But for kids it's a lot of steps. So they first, where are their shoes? What shoes do they want to wear? Did they already have their socks on? Like maybe their sock is uncomfortable and then the thought of putting it into a shoe is even worse.
Gwen Claussen [00:07:40]:
Are they good at tying their shoes? Like, what's going on? They could be thinking what's going on later that day? Are they like, is there a concern about what's going to happen if their shoe comes untied later? Like all those things go into them looking like they're just not listening to you. So when you try to think about what they're actually going through, it makes it a lot easier to Solve the problem and. And maybe offer them a little bit more help.
Greg Todd [00:08:09]:
Okay, here's a big one. How do I explain sensory processing challenges to family and friends? Like them not getting it and thinking that my kid is just bad. Is there any things you would say to that?
Gwen Claussen [00:08:28]:
So I think you can use that migraine example because most. Or headaches, most people have experienced that and can understand that.
Greg Todd [00:08:37]:
Okay.
Gwen Claussen [00:08:39]:
Wow. Yeah, you're right. Sometimes I don't have control over my ability to do things as I normally would when I'm headach. So, like, that can help. I also personally take the stance of my kids come first, and I really don't care about anyone else about it.
Greg Todd [00:08:57]:
I could see sit with you. Okay. All right. So here's another question for use in public places. I realize that sometimes the kids get super overstimulated. So how can I navigate that a bit better? You know, like, for instance, going to a basketball game. Right. Whereas for me, it's like, oh, that's cool.
Greg Todd [00:09:23]:
Like, you know, I didn't realize how, like, crazy that is for my son. So how can we navigate public spaces better with our kids?
Gwen Claussen [00:09:34]:
So one of the things that when my oldest was little and I was struggling with all of these things, I was complaining to someone that we couldn't even go out to dinner. And they were like, well, why do you need to go out to dinner? Like, does he need to be going out to dinner if he's that miserable doing it? Oh, that's a. That's a good point. So I do think, like, obviously you need to be able to do a lot of things with your kids, and sometimes they don't want to do it. But I overall like that conversation changed my perspective on things, and I stopped forcing my kids to do things that I wanted to do.
Greg Todd [00:10:19]:
Gotcha.
Gwen Claussen [00:10:20]:
That really wasn't benefiting for them and that I knew was gonna be hard on them. But when they do have to do things, I try to be prepared. So, I mean, all kids are different on what's going to set them off or going to be harder for them. So you might want to tell them in advance or not tell them in advance, depending on it. If you're doing something very loud and you know that's going to be a trigger for them and can bring like, if they like the noise canceling headphones or even.
Greg Todd [00:10:47]:
That's what we did.
Gwen Claussen [00:10:48]:
Yeah. Or even regular headphones and they can listen to something else that they actually like or like just bringing something, their favorite thing or just something to help them get through it.
Greg Todd [00:11:01]:
If we are having a meltdown, are there any communication tips you would give me if, like, that happens again?
Gwen Claussen [00:11:12]:
The best thing you can do with everyone that's having a meltdown is to not talk to them too much.
Greg Todd [00:11:21]:
And communication is. Shut up.
Gwen Claussen [00:11:24]:
Yeah. Sharing space with them, making them feel comfortable, letting them know that you're there with them. You can help them if it's. They're overwhelmed because of the noise, trying to get to somewhere quieter. Like, even at the basketball game, sometimes if you go into the bathroom, it's quieter in there, so they can regroup for a second. You can come up with a game plan, things like that.
Greg Todd [00:11:48]:
Okay. I think a lot of parents feel guilty when we don't understand what it is that our child is needing at the moment. Have you felt that?
Gwen Claussen [00:12:00]:
Oh, yeah.
Greg Todd [00:12:02]:
What. Maybe not what you tell yourself, but what would you tell a parent? It's like, I. I feel guilt sometimes not feeling like I can meet the needs of my child because I just don't understand. I don't know if there's something you tell parents at the clinic.
Gwen Claussen [00:12:17]:
Yeah. I think first, feeling guilty means that you're already doing a great job as a parent. And I think just reminding yourself that you are doing a good job. One of the things I would tell myself, too, back when things were really hard, it was like, you. He's having a hard time not giving me a hard time. So that way, like, just reframing it a little bit, which also gave me more space to think and try to figure out what the hard time was. Cause, Bri, and sometimes you're not going to get it, and you're going to get it wrong, and you're going to make it worse, and it's going to be hard, but you'll figure it out and it will get easier.
Greg Todd [00:13:01]:
With all the clients that you guys are seeing at Flourishing Lives, are there any particular tools that you frequently recommend for helping with sensory overload?
Gwen Claussen [00:13:12]:
Yeah, so there's some things that are really calming activities. Sorry. Things I have on hand are like suckers. Oral motor is a good way to calm the nervous system. So suckers, bubble gum, blowing bubbles, Things like that are good. Or like blowing through a straw or sucking through a straw.
Greg Todd [00:13:36]:
Interesting. Okay. Okay. So there are people out there. I know you guys see a lot of people. So you see anywhere between 160, 180 clients at your place a week. But I'm assuming there's a hell of a lot more parents that know they need help, but they just can't afford going to a Traditional, like, setup, like, what you have. Are there other affordable ways for people to at least get some type of help? Like, anything you'd recommend to somebody that's like, hey, I got no insurance.
Greg Todd [00:14:11]:
I can't afford it yet. Like, what would you tell them?
Gwen Claussen [00:14:14]:
Let's say a lot of the kids that come to us, they really need a lot of input to their bodies. So something easy to do at home is have a place that they can, like, jump and crash. It can be like a pile of pillows. Things you have on hand, they make different, like, foam, things that aren't too expensive that you can. Or even couch cushions, things like that. And things like riding a bike or just swinging at the park are all really helpful. And so if you can do that more, it's. It's not going to fix everything, but it's definitely going to help a little bit, at least get some of that energy out.
Greg Todd [00:14:52]:
So there was something that you said earlier, like, my kid doesn't have to do everything I do. Okay? I don't need to take them to every concert or this or that or whatever. But we do want our kids to engage in, like, a lot of activities. Are there things I can do to help my child? And I know I'm seeing me, but for everyone that's listening, that we could help our child if we're trying to get them to be able to engage in more daily activities. Any tips and tricks for that?
Gwen Claussen [00:15:23]:
I think one of the best things to do is to have them around their peers, which is why at our clinic, we share gym space and encourage the social interaction, because that just helps a lot more than if you're trying to do things just like kids, you adult or just alone.
Greg Todd [00:15:42]:
So when you guys do that, it's multiple patients at the same time, all in a gym area, and one therapist is working with this one, and they're all together. Oh, okay. Okay.
Gwen Claussen [00:15:52]:
A little chaotic at times, but. Yeah. But that's how you see the most progress. So if you're having them in activities where finding something that they like that meets their needs, but where they're also around other kids, it's helpful.
Greg Todd [00:16:08]:
Okay. Now, I know you are creating a new community, a support community, so I. I would like to ask you what, like, why do you feel like that has been so important? Why create that? What was your reasoning behind it?
Gwen Claussen [00:16:25]:
For a few different reasons. Like, one of them is, it is lonely, and you do start to feel bad about yourself and wonder if you're doing the right things or everything that you can. So creating A community of parents with similar struggles so that they can have each other to lean on. And it's also so we can provide more support to more people. So the community will have, like, an online library with resources, but also some, like, weekly meetings that people can come into and get support from our therapists and also from other parents.
Greg Todd [00:16:59]:
Gotcha. That's awesome. Let's talk about school. A lot of the kids that you guys are seeing are in school, and they're struggling. As a parent, I. I want to see my kid win. I, like, I want to see them win in their environment. I want to see them win at life, and I want them to be comfortable.
Greg Todd [00:17:25]:
So what things would you tell us as parents? What can we do to be an advocate for our kids as they're trying to navigate through that whole school thing?
Gwen Claussen [00:17:37]:
First, you set them up for success. So how we talked about the shoe thing, like, make their mornings easier so that when they do go to school, they're already in a good spot. Right. And a lot of times I would have my son ride his bike before school every day, like, no matter if he didn't do whatever he needed to do at home because it was getting him what he needed so that he could have a good day at school. The other thing is working with the teachers, letting them know in advance some of the problems that you're having. Some things that work at home.
Greg Todd [00:18:12]:
Right.
Gwen Claussen [00:18:13]:
That you already know of. And a lot of teachers now are really good at this stuff. Like, they have their own tricks. They can get through it, but you can always request extra services at school or evaluations and things if the problem continues.
Greg Todd [00:18:29]:
So just have to share with them and find. There's a lot of resources that, like, a lot of times we won't necessarily know, but you got to just ask.
Gwen Claussen [00:18:38]:
Yeah.
Greg Todd [00:18:38]:
Okay. All right. That's awesome. You. You talked about the community earlier, and I know you're creating kind of a community around parents feeling isolated. A lot of parents are feeling frustrated. Okay. Your community is not ready yet.
Greg Todd [00:18:54]:
At least at the time of this recording. It. It should be hopefully in a couple weeks.
Gwen Claussen [00:18:58]:
What.
Greg Todd [00:18:59]:
What would you say to that parent right now that's listening. That feels frustrated. They feel alone. They feel isolated. Give me some. Some Gwen wisdom for that.
Gwen Claussen [00:19:08]:
Oh, gosh. I would say speaking from experience, my personal experience, I've been there. I felt terrible. I've been through some of the worst things possible, but it does get better. And I do have the tendency to, like, keep things in and shut down and handle everything on my own. Yeah. But I have found, like, a good community here and, like, within our professional environment, and it does matter. And so that's why I do want to have that community, to give it to everyone else, because it makes it a lot easier to know that you're not going through things alone and also to, like, see other people's tips and tricks and what's worked for them.
Greg Todd [00:19:54]:
Right.
Gwen Claussen [00:19:55]:
What hasn't worked for them. And it makes the learning process a lot faster.
Greg Todd [00:20:00]:
I love it. Couple other things. So I want to feel more empowered. I want to feel more confident in supporting my child. You talked about some ways I can do it for them in school, which is just finding out the resources. Right. You know, for them. We talk about ways that we can do this, like, in public.
Greg Todd [00:20:31]:
What are other ways that I'm missing? Like, that I, like, have any thought of ways, like, other areas where I can feel like I'm empowering my kid. Besides school and other places, is there anything else that I missed?
Gwen Claussen [00:20:44]:
I think I don't really know if there's anything else, but one thing I would add is that talking to your kids and treating them as you would treat an adult, so, like, acknowledging that they have feelings and they have emotions and it's okay for them to not like things or to be having a hard time with things, like, the more you validate them as people, the better your relationship will be and the more open and willing to talk to you and work through things, they'll be okay.
Greg Todd [00:21:19]:
So as you were saying that, I was thinking, you know, where I was kind of going with that. It's like, it's in the house. It's in the house. So you got one child that's struggling with these sensory issues and meltdowns or whatnot, and then you have one or two others that aren't, and it's trying to, like, manage that. So it's like, I want to support you, but I also want, like. Like, things to be okay over here. Help. Help.
Gwen Claussen [00:21:50]:
That's, like, one of the hardest parts, especially as a parent, when you're trying to. Because you want the best for all your kids and you want them to be happy and healthy and thriving and having everything you ever dreamed of. And when one is struggling more than the others, it's. It is hard. But hopefully you have good communication with all of them and are, like, celebrating the good times, taking advantage of those, and then just, like, checking in with everyone after the bad times and repairing.
Greg Todd [00:22:24]:
For those of you that are listening, I hope you realize that over the last few 1520 minutes. You've gotten a lot of value on things that you can do. Like right now, because I'm listening, I'm like, I can do that right now. Okay, now let's talk about if we were to go see someone. Like what you offer at your company or any pediatric ota, I should say, Eddie. But people that specialize in what it is that you do, what in particular would you tell someone that doesn't live in St. Clair Shores and they need to find someone that's good like y'all. What are some of the things they should be looking for in a therapist if they are going to go on this journey of having someone, a professional help them?
Gwen Claussen [00:23:06]:
I think one of the things we do different is that it's child led therapy, therapist guided. So we have our clinic, it's open, the kids can go wherever they want to do whatever they want to, so safely.
Greg Todd [00:23:21]:
Gotcha.
Gwen Claussen [00:23:21]:
The therapist goes with them.
Greg Todd [00:23:23]:
Right.
Gwen Claussen [00:23:23]:
And then they will modify slightly whatever the child is trying to do to meet their goals.
Greg Todd [00:23:30]:
So that'd be called like a self guided clinic. Is there a name for it or is that just something you guys came up with?
Gwen Claussen [00:23:36]:
It's, there's other clinics that do it. So child led.
Greg Todd [00:23:38]:
A child led.
Gwen Claussen [00:23:39]:
Yeah. So it's more, it's less of you need to do this five times. Like, you know, in general, like rehab, pt, it's gotta do your reps, you gotta do whatever. We don't do that. It's fun there or it's play based. So the kids just think they're having the best time. But the therapists are actually very skillfully adjusting their environment to work towards their therapy goals.
Greg Todd [00:24:04]:
Okay, awesome. So now whether they're coming to a facility like yours or even the stuff that you just shared with us, how do I know things are getting better?
Gwen Claussen [00:24:17]:
Let's see it.
Greg Todd [00:24:18]:
You see?
Gwen Claussen [00:24:18]:
Yeah, it depends on what you're going for, like what your goals are when you're going in, what the problems are and what they're actually working on. So we do like decreasing meltdowns is always one of our goals. Like just all the socialization, the things, the, the real issues that are bothering parents. We're also working on like coordination, fine motor, gross motor skills. But those real like social problems is what we're working towards. And so typically our families notice significant difference within the first few visits. Like life starts to get a little bit easier. Yeah.
Gwen Claussen [00:24:59]:
And then some. At some points you'll notice something else that's hard and like it changes and kids are growing and changing so like, it's always going to be different, but you should be able to not improvement.
Greg Todd [00:25:11]:
And things, you know, I'm a data guy and you know, I like to like write stuff down in my little planner. Do you think we should, like us as parents, we should like write down okay, amount of meltdowns this week, this, then next week, like, is that one way or is that like, am I being way too anal with this?
Gwen Claussen [00:25:27]:
I mean, maybe it wasn't, but it is good because when you're a parent and you're like stuck in the hard part, it's sometimes difficult to see that you have like, things have gotten easier to realize. Like, oh my gosh, we made it out the door to go to school with no one crying. Like, that is a huge accomplishment. And then like, at first you're gonna think like, oh, it was just one time, like, it's a fluke, whatever. But then the more times it starts to happen, like your life is now changed a little bit for the better, and then you'll keep seeing more and more of those things.
Greg Todd [00:26:01]:
Okay, can I ask you two more questions?
Gwen Claussen [00:26:02]:
Yeah.
Greg Todd [00:26:03]:
Okay. All right. So self soothing. How can I teach myself self soothing techniques for, I guess like sensory overload. What, what, what are soothing things? You said one of them where like put them in a, a small room, right, with lights off and whatnot. Are there any other like self soothing hacks out there?
Gwen Claussen [00:26:26]:
So it depends on what works for them and what you find. But I think like, the more once you figure that out, the more you assist them with those things, the more they'll start to do that on their own when they. And like, there are some programs to help the one's called like, how does your engine run? It helps teach kids to like, recognize when they're becoming just regular.
Greg Todd [00:26:48]:
How does your engine run?
Gwen Claussen [00:26:49]:
Yeah.
Greg Todd [00:26:50]:
Okay. It's a program or a book?
Gwen Claussen [00:26:52]:
It's a program. I think it's a book too, but okay.
Greg Todd [00:26:57]:
Awesome. All right, so here's my last thing for you. Advice. What advice do you have for us as parents to stay hopeful and resilient as we're going through this journey? You've been through it. What advice do you have for us.
Gwen Claussen [00:27:17]:
Just to like, be easy on yourself. Like everything's hard when you're doing it, but once you can look back, like maybe write stuff down like you were saying so that you can see, like that the effort you're putting in, the worry that you've had, like that things are starting to get better and that you are doing a good job. So just remembering that every little bit you're doing is actually helping and making a difference in their lives.
Greg Todd [00:27:47]:
Awesome. Okay. Sorry. I. I give her. You gave me all this in my city, so thank you so much. And I'm sure all the other parents thank you as well. You guys should create a tracker.
Greg Todd [00:27:59]:
You guys should create that.
Gwen Claussen [00:28:00]:
Yeah.
Greg Todd [00:28:01]:
Maybe we could team up on it or something like that. Tracker. Like a meltdown tracker or something. I don't know what you want to call it. Oh, my God, it'd be so cool. Okay. Anyways, what I'm going to do below is you're creating your community, and I think probably at the time that this is live, it will be live. So what I'm going to do is wherever you guys are watching this or listening to this, there's probably a description section.
Greg Todd [00:28:23]:
Look below. And I have here. I want to say this before I end the podcast. I've gone to Gwen's facility, and I've seen what she has fostered, what she has built. I know her personally, and you might not know me, but I can tell you this. I can totally vouch for her on how passionate she is for wanting parents to get through this. And. And so if there was going to be a community that I was going to join with regards to this, this is the one that I would be a part of.
Greg Todd [00:29:04]:
And if I lived in St. Clair Shores, Michigan, I. I would actually. I'd actually use you guys because you. Because you have an amazing staff, amazing team, and you're an amazing, amazing leader. So thank you for being on the podcast. Appreciate it.
Gwen Claussen [00:29:17]:
Thank you for having me. All right.
